Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:14] Speaker B: Welcome to Battle Ready where we equip you with the mindset and strategies to face the challenges that test your strength, your purpose and leadership. I'm your host, Ricky Chavez. Today's episode, it tackles one of the biggest hurdles professionals face. Selling yourself with confidence instead of fear. Joining me today is Dr. Deepak Butra, a leadership coach, a system thinker and trust advisor to executives and early stage organizations. With decades of experience in emotional intelligence, reinvention and purpose driven leadership, he helps people rise with clarity, courage and integrity. Today we're diving into why communicating your values can feel so intimidating and how to shift from discomfort to confidence. Dr. Butra, welcome to Battle Ready. Let's get started with today's topic.
[00:00:59] Speaker A: Welcome.
Thank you, sir. I'm all ready for the battle. My axis ground shiny, ready to go.
[00:01:06] Speaker B: That's what I'm talking about. You know, many people know their worth internally, but struggle to express externally the fear of judgment. Being misunderstood or appearing pushy often keeps people silent, unseen and underpaid. Why does selling or promoting yourself feels so uncomfortable for most people?
[00:01:24] Speaker A: So you, you, you speaking to a selling guy, right? I'm a B2B sales guy. Ricky, you're a real estate guru, right? And the reality is that you and I are considered to be outliers, right? For. But let's give the answer from a common person's point of view, right? Even when you're an expert in selling and you will agree with this, Ricky, that, you know, the reality is that even someone who's an expert at selling, like you or me, we always have this fear that we're going to get exposed at some point, right? Because we actually always confuse ourselves in terms of how we're approaching people. When I am promoting myself, there's some things that happen with my upbringing now, coming from a family that actually used to tell you to show humility and not to brag about yourself. Now here you are, you're trying to sell yourself, you're trying to promote yourself. And promotion doesn't come naturally to some people. Then you have the other extreme. It comes unnaturally to a lot of people and you can see that they are simply buying time or, or buying favor. And I think it's, it's just human of us. We actually also confuse promotion with being a sense of arrogance. That's not true. A lot of us get triggered by guilt from it and not actually realizing that promotion is a form of confidence.
So when you start telling yourself that, you know, when you're promoting yourself, you're actually putting the Best of you out there for people to benefit from, then that mindset makes a huge change. And that's what I always recommend to people, that your uncomfort comes from the. Your mindset, your upbringing. You got to understand that when you're promoting yourself, you're promoting something which will help the person that you're promoting to. When you have that servant mindset, you don't feel that you're being pushy or taller. That's how I would position Ricky.
[00:02:51] Speaker B: That response, funny. You know, I was in the military also for 20 years and I remember having an old boss and he, he told me, ricky, you need to be able to sell some, send somebody to hell and make them look forward to the trip, you know, And I thought that was pretty kind of spot on if you want to think about it.
[00:03:09] Speaker A: Right.
[00:03:10] Speaker B: It's just how you present it.
[00:03:12] Speaker A: Most military metaphors are resonate with me because they are grounded in reality. They kind of, you know, take away that pretense that we have in your leg. You stuck. Now, you know what? That is meaningful. It hurts, but it's meaningful here.
[00:03:24] Speaker B: Yeah. So how does someone shift from feeling pushy to feeling proud of what they offer?
[00:03:30] Speaker A: For me, the change occurred when my boss actually told me, you know, Deepak, I'm watching yourself. And I just noticed this. You seem to have something else on your mind. It's like you're worried about the fact that you're at 80% of quota and you need this deal to close the 20%. So you are there to sell something, you're not there to serve someone. And I think that's a problem for me. And I was offended by that because to me, Niki, that sounded like, what is he talking about? You pay me to sell? Right then I realized what he was talking about was framing. When you are pushing your agenda, which is your agenda, you're always going to be in trouble. But when you start pushing other people's agenda, which and then connect yours to that. So if my solution or this property that I'm giving someone is going to make a big difference in their lifestyle, in their well being and how they raise their family, then position that first. Think about that experience first and then think about what your check is going to look like and how are you going to go to Cabo or going to go to Cancun based on that money. And I think that's where it becomes disappointing. And it took me a lot of effort to actually start thinking about positioning my customer first and not bringing the thought that used to be Front of mind, which is I need to make this to make my code, otherwise I'm going to look stupid to that is the back. That is the byproduct, not the main product. That mindset helped me a lot in terms of how I used to position it. I'm here to serve, not to sell.
And a tip that I can give you Ricky, which is so cool. A lot of the VPs that I coach tell me this is the most and you charge me so much money for something which is like 2 cents deeper. Take a sticky note and on it, right? It's not your pain, it's theirs that matters.
Stick that on your monitor when you're talking to a customer. And every time I feel that I am focusing on myself or I'm not using the two is to one ratio while dealing with the customer, I go back to that little sticky note. And that sticky note grounds you. It actually says you're here to serve, not sell. So when you keep serving, you keep selling to that pain of theirs. What the problem that they're solving for. It makes a world of difference.
[00:05:22] Speaker B: I'll tell you this, that brings up two thoughts to me.
I run a team of realtors and I tell them don't chase money, take care of people.
Kind of same mindset, right? And you can tell when you're good.
[00:05:36] Speaker A: Absolutely.
Service mindset is what I hear you talking about, right Ricky? Then there is, there's the self. This is the self service. How do you say the self serving mindset, right? Which is my check and I think it's important and I know these are play on words, self serving versus service. And I want to use these simple words because to be honest with you, it's simple.
When you are focused on serving people, your decision making is nuanced, it's sharper. You're less likely to also make integrity violating decisions, right? Or decisions that make your mom, you know, she's having a cup of coffee and she hears about something you said or did which disappoints her because she didn't raise you to be like that. And those things happen when you are selling. They will never happen when you're serving.
It's just a little thing I tell people.
[00:06:23] Speaker B: I totally agree with that. I know that in dealing with other agents or even when I, you know, I was an army recruiter, right? That was, you know, nobody wakes up in the morning want to join the army. But what I did learn was that people sell differently when they're doing good things, the way they present themselves, how they speak to people. And I read a book. Have you ever read the book Go Giver? I'm sure you have Go Giver.
[00:06:47] Speaker A: Yes, yes. So it was recommended to me by another sales coach who said read it. It'll change your perspective of why you are always going to focus on making the other person feel at the center of the universe.
[00:07:00] Speaker B: And I believe in, in that I sell with that mentality because it's all about connecting people for their value, not for yours. With any expectations.
[00:07:09] Speaker A: I would agree with that.
[00:07:11] Speaker B: Can you share a story where a person learned to communicate better and change their life or business?
[00:07:18] Speaker A: You know, that person is most likely going to be me. I have so many stories about my own self preservation and my own. But there's this client of mine, and this is a client that I'm really proud of because when I first met him, I did not want him as a client. And I'll tell you why, Ricky, he was so self engrossed with his one, he considered himself to be the smartest person in the room.
Number two, he was a double engineering, bachelor's and masters from let's say Ivy League le. I leave it at Ivy League level. So now you have this potent combination, someone who's too smart, someone who knows everything and you know what he's going to go try to sell and it gets really interesting. So when I was listening to him, he came to me because he wanted my help in preparing for an interview.
And I said that's interesting, let's do that. But when I was listening to him, actually realized that he's not going to take my advice because he knows all the answers already. How do I make this person understand how to do this right?
And what happened was really interesting. I actually made it very clear and I was very direct with him. And the point I made was that you love jargon. And when you throw jargon out there, you sound academic. And people don't hire academics, people hire practitioners, people who actually can come and do the shit they say they can do. Sorry about the language there, Ricky.
[00:08:29] Speaker B: Right, I like that.
[00:08:30] Speaker A: And the biggest problem for you and I is that, you know, you get someone who's going to tell you about how deep the board should go into the ground, what colors the background of the board color should be. But when, when you go visit them, you realize that he put the board in the wrong place where no one can see it because it's behind the bushes. Then you ask yourself so much, focus on all of the rest of the stuff, but the basic fundamentals was just missing. You'd place the board in the wrong place, no one can see it. So no one's going to come to the, to the, to the Sunday afternoon house on show what is going on? And that's what I was explaining to this individual. Now initially there was a huge pushback. But I tell you what, Ricky, when people actually see logic and understanding and they start applying what actually happened with he shifted from giving long technical explanations to actually position things with emotional clarity. And I think that's very powerful when you bring emotional clarity into a conversation and when you actually connect the dots and you take storytelling as a framework of choice, not fact dumping. That trick is what makes a difference to people. So I've always said to people when I listen them, I said, look, I met someone that was super smart. He actually changed his behavior even though I'd been doing the same thing for the last 15 years. Now, habits can be changed, but it requires a lot of effort and the mindset to do that requires you to be very self aware. This individual wanted that job. He saw the North Star and he then worked very hard toward the North Star. And I must be honest with you, he surprised me because I went from saying that I don't want him as a customer at all because I think he's hard assed. Again, bad language. Please delete all this. But sorry about that, but it's really funny. He was, but he at the same time inside, very deep, had never been challenged. Ricky. And I think this is what we need to think even at your age, my age, Ricky, sometimes we like being challenged. I have a lot of customers telling me, I don't think I would do it that way. I would simple, okay, tell me how you do it. And many times I agree with them because they bring a perspective that I might be missing. So that's how I would answer that question.
[00:10:19] Speaker B: Ricky, you know, the last step, the last statement you just made kind of resonates with me, you know, because.
So I've been in an agent for eight years. I was in leadership, I've been in leadership forever.
But I think I talk to people and I see a lot of people that ask a question and when somebody gives them the answer, the first thing out of their mouth. I know, but I told one of my agents the other day, listen, when you ask a question, let them tell you, regardless of, you know, it or not, let them speak because they may go in a different way. They may give you a perspective that you never even thought about. Well, by cutting them off, I think you lose more than they lose. What do you think about that?
[00:11:05] Speaker A: I agree with that.
My ex boss used to tell me, just because you have two ears and one mouth, and let me put it, you have two ears and one mouth, that doesn't mean that you. That means that you should be listening twice more than you're speaking, Deepak. And when you take that little shift, you actually realize that some basic things are there for a reason in selling. So I would agree with you, Ricky. At the end of the day, it's about proportion. It's about intentionality, focus. You get that, right? Everything falls into place.
[00:11:32] Speaker B: I totally agree with you. So we're running out of time. Coming up next, we dive into one of the most universal fears. Hearing. No. Stay with us. We'll be right back.
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[00:12:15] Speaker A: You know.
[00:12:16] Speaker B: Welcome back to Battle Ready. We're here with Dr. Deepak Butra. And in this segment, we're going to talk. We're going to be tackling the fear of rejection. A fear that stops careers, business and dreams in their tracks. Welcome back, Dr. Deepak.
[00:12:28] Speaker A: Thank you, sir.
[00:12:30] Speaker B: So, so why is rejection such a powerful fear for people in business and life?
[00:12:36] Speaker A: Because rejection is personal, Ricky. Our human brain is a social being, right? We, we covet warmth. We want, we don't want to sit in a room with cold people, right? So the problem with us is that when we hear a no, when we get rejected, we take it personal. We feel that we, our Persona, our me, the person has been rejected. And I think this is, you know, you're, you're a sports guy, right? You know, playing the ball versus playing the person. And I think this is where as humans, we sometimes fail each other.
We think that rejection is personal because our brains, right, it looks at that and feels that, hey, wait a minute, I'm just being excluded. There's something going on here. Am I in danger? Do people not like me anymore? And that's what's happening here. You know, we look at the outcome. I won a deal, I lost a deal. And that then designs it. If you win a deal, you're top of the world. You lose a deal, you're now going to go get a shot of Whiskey and pass out drunk.
What happened there? Why the difference in approach? And I think that's exactly the problem, because we don't like no. We have been conditioned to think of no as a personal loss, whereas it's a professional loss. And how you recover from a professional loss is very different from how you recover from a personal loss. And unfortunately, when you conflate the two, you're asking for trouble. That's how I would position rejection and ask people to think about it.
[00:13:49] Speaker B: One of the things I told you earlier, that I was a military recruiter, and then I tried the recruiting school and, you know, I always told them, if you take it personal, it sucks to be you, because those people don't know you. They just know what you're doing as a military recruiter. So, you know, don't take it personal. And the second thing I said was you have to get through all the no's to find the yes. And there's yeses out there. So if you take that journey, you know, it usually works out.
[00:14:16] Speaker A: It's. It's a very powerful statement. There are yeses out there. And our problem is that we're so fixated with the no's that we are now missing out on the joy of finding that yes.
[00:14:27] Speaker B: 100. Right. So how can someone separate their worth from the outcome of a single conversation?
[00:14:33] Speaker A: I think by defining your worth first. Right. For me, worth is defined as character, not results. And here's the problem with the world, right? So I. And to be honest with you, Rick, it's not the world. It's just how we have to market ourselves. Everyone wants to buy from someone that sold 10 houses on a winning streak. Right? And each house. And I've just sold $3.6 million worth of property in one week. We need numbers like that. Awesome. But the reality also is that when you focus on output and numbers, you are always find yourself on the back foot. And the reality is that if you want to separate that, you need to actually focus on this. I sold 10 properties or I sold one property that made someone very happy. Now, did you make your number? And so on. That's a different conversation. Right? And every conversation, Ricky, to be honest with you, right, is your. Your. Your worth is going to come under impact because of something you said, which is you are listening to the no's. You're not focused on the yeses. The yeses will come. They don't necessarily come in a pattern, Ricky. Right. You know that. I mean, look, after one year, you will tell me that, Deepak, this Is my ratio in selling properties. I speak to 100 customers, maybe 13 by 13.
That doesn't mean that if you had 87 people saying no, the next 13 are all going to buy from you, right, Ricky? That's not going to happen, guys. Now, if you know that pragmatically, then I have a simple question for you then. Why are you surprised when you get a no or a yes?
That pattern should be there. It comes, it happens. Take it in stride. Because it's a mathematics game, but you cannot predict it's randomness. But we are human beings always looking at a pattern.
And to test that, Ricky, this is what I usually do with one of my clients. I throw a series of numbers at the numbers and I just tell them, what do you see? And 99% of the time the guy will tell me, oh, wait, Deepak, I think the first number is a odd number, and then I think you add three on every number. And that's what I see here. That's a pattern, right? And I'm like, no, there is no pattern. It's actually purely random numbers I threw at it. But the human brain looks for patterns and fitment, and that's when the problem starts, Ricky.
[00:16:26] Speaker B: Okay, that's, that's pretty interesting. I know that in, in the goal setting and when we sit down with our agents, or even when I sat down with recruiters, it's all about the numbers, right? And, and I think the human challenge we have is, is if it's 30 to 1 and you get the yes on number 15, most people don't do the other 30. They just stop there.
[00:16:50] Speaker A: They just. Because, yeah, yeah. And, and this is in, in selling, you know, people tell me, deepak, what are the three things that a salesperson should do to become a great salesperson? And I say there are three buckets. Behavior, attitude, and technique. Technique is the one where you know when a price objection comes up, how to handle that.
Right. Attitude is where mindset comes into play, that you're always going to focus on your self worth, your identity, separate from your role. Keep a clean mindset. Right? No, take it in stride. Behavior is the one, Ricky, that really matters. Behavior says, I may be down, I may be high, but behavior is that I still have 30 dials to do.
I have to take the nose and the yeses. I still have 16 boards to bang into the pavement. That's behavior. And a lot of people get confused when I say that, When I say behavior is quantifiable activity that you do, which is measurable, and behavior Is going to show you as a leading indicator as to what's actually going to happen. Because if you're not doing the 30 dials a day, you're not going to get the 30 deals a year. If you're not doing the 16 boards pounding into the ground over the weekend, you ain't going to get that one sale at the end of the month. It's all related to it. So behavior actually becomes the positive attitude that you take and you do a measurement and an activity judgment. You actually have to capture this and then see, did I do the 30 dials? Yes. No. If you didn't do the 30 dials, carry on, do the 30 dials and then move on. Because that is also what consistency and habit forming is not going to happen overnight. Right, Ricky? You know that. And the second. And you said something very powerful. I just want a deal. I'm on cloud nine. Do I need to do the remaining 13 dials? Most people will say no. And I say, okay, fine, take a break for a day. Maybe celebrate. Because we do need to celebrate as human beings. We do not celebrate sufficiently, Ricky. I guarantee you that. And we celebrate the big stuff. What about the small stuff?
Today I had the highest number of people walking through this house to see it. Celebrate that you didn't sell the house, but that's what you're talking about. I had the highest number of people walking in, but no one bought. Shame on me. What a bad day. No, great day. The number of people walking through that house was the highest you've ever seen. Celebrate that. Go have a beer. That's the mindset that I'm preaching about.
[00:18:54] Speaker B: I know. I definitely got to celebrate every small victory because today you might only have a small victory, but tomorrow it might be just a grand slam, right?
[00:19:03] Speaker A: Yeah, it is. And, and, and that's what this game is about, Rick. If everything was easy, Ricky, why would people then, if selling was so easy or if selling was so glamorous, wouldn't more children being on at birth, being told by their mom and pop, looking into the cradle, my son will grow up to be a doctor. My son is going to grow up to be an engineer. But there's no Indian parent saying, I want my son to grow up and sell real estate. I want my son to grow up and be a seller. B2B seller. Why? Because there's a stigma attached to it. And because people know how difficult this game is.
And this is the Indian in me kicking in. Right?
You know, cultural upbringing and so on. Back to you, sir. I'M digressing. I'll tell you this.
[00:19:43] Speaker B: I think this is actually the funnest thing I've ever done. I mean, and I've done a lot of different things, but as far as you know, the way I approach it, it's, it's just. This is fun. It's all about the journey for them, not the journey for me.
And if their journey ends up happy, I did what I needed to do.
The money is just a byproduct, right?
[00:20:07] Speaker A: The, the, the money is a reward for doing the right things. That's how I explain it to people. And your goal is to do the right things so that when the money comes, you actually sleep better at night. I've always told people the difference between burnout and achievement is as follows. You do the same work, but when you go to bed, you sleep so deep because your internal mechanisms have been sati satisfied. You have hit those metrics that really matter. Burnout happens when you actually have hit all the metrics that don't matter. And now you can't sleep because you are tired, but you're tired the wrong way. And I don't know how to explain this, Ricky, but I've noticed. But there's a great indicator for burnout that I share with my clients. I ask them, how deep is your sleep and how many hours do you get it? What is surprising is that, Ricky, beyond five hours of deep sleep, I'm actually not seeing any major difference. What tells me that if you can get five hours of deep, solid sleep and nowadays everyone's got a smartwatch, Ricky, I actually recommend to people, just go wake up in the morning and have a look at your watch and see what the watch is telling you. The watch can actually predict you, Ricky, when you're going to start feeling really, really, really weird. And I actually use this to control my own interaction, even down to when I eat food as well, Ricky. Because now at age 55, Ricky, my body reacts to sugar differently, right? If I skip a meal, I actually feel physically different than I used to be when I was 21, 25 years old, hustling, hustling all the time.
So, again, a digression. Back to you, sir.
[00:21:27] Speaker B: You know, it's, it's when I hear you say that and I hear you talk about sleep, I, I'm, I'm, I'm a weirdo. I guess if I sleep more than four hours, I'm totally exhausted. And, but that's, I mean, after years and years of doing what I do, I mean, four hours is, is My magic number I, I get up at 4:13 every morning I and, and by 8:15 I, I realize whether I'm going to work that day or not. That's a beautiful.
[00:21:51] Speaker A: Because you pounded the pavement sufficiently enough. I think there's something very powerful in what you're saying and I'm very cognizant of the time but I want to just quickly squeeze this in. Ricky, you're very self aware and self awareness gives tremendous power. So if there's anyone on this call listening or to anyone and thinking that it's two old men talking, here's my guidance to you. What Ricky is actually talking about, and Ricky, apologize if I'm getting this wrong is the fact that Ricky has over time figured out what makes him tick, what makes him tick the best. And he has regimentalized it and that might be the military background, just common sense. But the reality is that when I realize that if I skip a meal I get a cranky feeling and my business decision is bad, I stop. Then I realize no. So I now have a box of Costco nut bars. So whenever I feel that I don't have time for a meal, I just take a two minute break and chow the one down. It keeps me going and that's call it like a weird idea. But guess what? It's about energy management. Right Nick? And energy management comes in different ways and that starts with being self aware.
[00:22:48] Speaker B: That's amazing. So Dr. Butu, where can viewers connect with you or follow your work or access your coaching resources?
[00:22:56] Speaker A: So Ricky, I live on LinkedIn. I'm there four hours a day and, and it's not rent free of course, but for the amount of money I paid LinkedIn, I'm grateful.
Find me on LinkedIn. Ladies and gentlemen, I am what I call someone who loves virtual coffee a lot. Drop me a DM and say hey Deepak, would love to pick your brain on something. Let's have a conversation. I am pretty straightforward. I also have a website, Ricky, and I think it's just very simple. Deepakbutra.com or and it's connected to deepak.butra.com I for some wacky reason managed to get the butra.com.
it's like getting chavez.com. wouldn't that freak you out if you could pull that off? I pull it off.
I picked it up in 2009 because the person before me forgot to renew it.
[00:23:40] Speaker B: Well, you know what? I don't know about the name Butra, but Chavez is like Smith and Jones. It's just Mexican.
[00:23:45] Speaker A: Exactly. But the butra is not that common. I agree with you, really. The probability of getting a butra was very low. And in fact, I didn't see it for many years. The person that actually owned it was a person in Dubai of all places. And he's related to me. He's like a six cousin or something. Right?
[00:24:01] Speaker B: That's cool.
[00:24:03] Speaker A: But the excitement of getting it was and I'm not going to lose it. In fact, I told the kids, there you go. We got seven generations can now host themselves on it. So just put your name the create a subdomain and you're in business.
[00:24:12] Speaker B: Back to you, perfect. So up next, we explore the pressure to be imperfect now silently sabotage performance.
Stay tuned. We'll be right back.
Welcome back to Battle Ready. In this segment, we're addressing perfectionism, one of the biggest barriers that high achievers face. It creates pressure, anxiety and self doubt, leaving people feeling like one mistake to destroy everything.
Now many professionals push themselves to impossible standards, sacrificing creativity, joy and growth. Back with Dr. Deepak.
Mr. Deepak, tell me, what is perfectionist? Why is perfection so common among high achievers?
[00:25:01] Speaker A: Because that's what we've been told.
If you want to be a high achiever and if you have ambition, then you need to do everything perfectly. Your P's have to be beautifully shaped, your eyes have to be dotted, your T's have to be crossed. And then we spend our entire life focusing on that. But the thing that we actually missed in this entire interpretation is as follows.
Not everything you do will deliver the same value.
And I think what people need to understand is that perfectionism, when you deliver the same amount of effort on everything, it's going to suck the life out of you. And high achievers unfortunately are good with perfectionism because they make it into a habit. But the reality is that you need to be perfect on those things which deliver the most value. I'll give a classic example.
I coach people who are high performers and they're going into an interview, they will agonize over the choice of a tie for 20 minutes, but they will not agonize over the fact that their preparation is not really hot on some of the behavioral situational questions that they're going to get right.
They've not done the research on the company good enough or then they go overboard. They do research on the company down to even understanding the name of the CEO's wife.
Why shouldn't you be spending more time in understanding his journey to building the company, what challenges he faced and what challenges he's going to face the next five years so that you can talk about that in the interview. And I think that that's. Perfectionism by itself is not an issue. Perfectionism unfettered is a big challenge in this world. We need to be focused on perfection, on things that matter. Unfortunately, we focus on perfectionism on everything that doesn't matter. I have a current client who is, what I would say, obsessive compulsive. You know, when you're in a slide, Ricky, the guy will Tap the keyboard 17 times on the arrow key to just move the icon a little bit because he says I'm a perfectionist.
But when I tell him to give me a 30 second elevator pitch of what he's putting on that slide, he can't do that.
That's your problem right there. All I'm saying to people is be perfect, but be perfect in the things that actually are perfect, that contribute to the right definition. And I think that's where the challenge is. Perfectionism unfettered is a huge challenge. And we need to focus on. And I'm really highly focused on. I've always told people there's no such thing as time management.
It's always priority management.
If you get your priorities right, you'll get your time management right. Your time will always occupy you because you don't know what to prioritize. And I focus people on that and I'm telling you I've changed lives because people are suddenly realized, oh my gosh, prioritization actually means to figure out which item needs to be done now, which item cannot be done, doesn't need to be done, give it away to someone else to do and maybe reject something, negotiate a new deadline. People don't think that way. So again, bit long winded, but that's how I would position Enrique.
[00:27:42] Speaker B: Really don't ever think you're long way. I think it's that our audience needs to hear these things and, and if you want to present them like that, that makes the most sense. A couple things that I took out of what you just said. One of them is you kind of prioritizing. You know, people spend so much time in their circle of concern instead of their circle of influence, right? How do you feel about that?
[00:28:03] Speaker A: You? I, I love, I love that circle of. You know I'm coming from sales, right? Ricky, let's talk about circular influence for one second. I know it's a digression, but it's so powerful. So powerful.
There are people in real estate selling, right? And circle of influence is A very simple art. Circle of influence says that when you're selling a property, are you selling to the guy that's got the checkbook? Are you selling to the person that's ultimately going to make the decision? Have you figured that out? Is it his wife, is it his mom? In my house? I can tell you right now, if you're selling to me, you're making a big mistake. Sell the property to my wife, sell the property to my wife and you're going to have a surprise of your life. And I learned a very hard lesson. I used to think that buying cars was my responsibility.
Ricky. I went to BMW dealership. This 22 year old dude flipped everything on me. He came up and said to me, hi, welcome to BMW, how can I help you? And I said, oh, we just browsing around. He looked at my wife and my wife had that look on her face of I don't want to be here because she doesn't want to be there. Honestly. Ketan focuses attention on her now. He said, I was standing beside the BMW 4 Series, the new one that was being launched and he was giving me the specs and my wife had a glazed look. Then my wife said to him, the only car he's allowed to buy is a car that's electric.
The guy says to her, ma', am, your dream is about to come true. The BMW i4 is actually coming out and said, but there's a nine month waiting period.
Then he looked at my wife and said to her, I see you like sustainability. Would you like to test her? I actually have an i4 here.
And my wife says, oh yeah, I would love to try a test drive. I cannot tell you. I got my i4, I just got the electric version of it. I didn't get the two door Brooklyn Gray that I wanted, but I ended up getting an electric car because he sold to my wife. And I think that's the power of influence. When you understand that circle of influence and you focus on it, it delivers you the clarity that you need to know what to do and what to focus on. Instead of having a conversation that would have taken the car selling process all over the place or the house selling process all over the place.
By focusing on the circle of influence, you actually know what to address and let your perfectionism shine in that space only. So Ricky, I think there's a powerful message in what you just said there.
Now, Akib, I won't talk anymore on that, but clearly.
[00:30:12] Speaker B: No, no, you're good, you're good.
[00:30:14] Speaker A: You want to conserve your Energy and energy conservation is so important in this game. You get 30 minutes in a cold call. I have always to people tell me, deepak, how long should a cold call last? I said, I don't care.
Let me tell you what the first 30 seconds mean though, because if you don't get your point across in the first 30 seconds, you're never going to get the next three minutes anyway.
[00:30:35] Speaker B: Right?
[00:30:35] Speaker A: End of story, buddy. That's how life is. It's the same thing with, you know, you have an opportunity window. Let's focus on the circle of influence, talk about things that really do matter and let's perfect those rather than for perfection on I want to get the shade of this, I want to do this or. Ma', am, would you like a cup of coffee? It's sustainable, grown in Brazil. That sounds cool, but it's stupidity to my wife at that point because she doesn't, she's not going to stand in a BMW dealership drinking a freaking coffee. Even though you think it's sustainability. And you figured out the angle to this woman's brain. No, no, no. The guy figured out the angle to the woman's brain is actually get her to drive this sustainable car, which is electric, and prove to her how electric has and what BMW. She drove the car, she turned a corner, she bumped over the pavement because the car is too long for her driving abilities. The BMW i4 is a long car.
She came back and she's raving and the guy is sweating because he actually said to me later on I thought I was going to die. The way your wife was driving, she loved that car. She was gunning it because she was shocked how good electric car could be. The guy taught me a lesson that day, Ricky. He actually sold to the person that and she drives wanted to buy that car more than I do. He figured out who's going to hold him back from buying the car and he sold to that person because he knew I'm going to buy the car. He knew that, but he now need to make sure that there was a derailer who's a derailer in that circle of influence. It was my wife, sir. We kind of went off charts into sales technique. But hey, guess what?
[00:31:55] Speaker B: Oh, and listen, I mean, I, I agree with that. I mean, I've been married almost 30. Next month will be 30 years. And I don't think I've chosen a house I've lived in or a car that I drive because I really don't care. But they go to my wife. She, she gets what she wants. She. I mean, she.
[00:32:11] Speaker A: You're right, correct.
[00:32:13] Speaker B: So one other thing you said earlier, I know we're going to move back a little bit, but you talked about perfection. Perfection, perfection. I always heard growing up, practice makes perfect. And probably midway, you know, I played semi pro football in Europe and I had a coach that told me practice doesn't make perfect.
He says perfect, practice makes perfect. You want to talk about that?
[00:32:36] Speaker A: That's such a powerful question. It's doing the right things at the right time, at the right quantity.
And this is still. It's, it's, it's, it's. It appeared to be semantics, but it's not. It's very powerful. The question that you asked, right, look, at the end of the day, we know that habits are formed by practicing the same thing again and again.
People have written tons of work on this, right? If you do something for 10,000, that's hours. That's when you become an expert, right? There's this yardstick we've been given.
The reality though is that if you're going to spend 10,000 hours on a keyboard, on a piano and you're going to keep banging the same chord again and again and again, you're going to become perfect on that chord. Only you need to spend the 10,000 hours banging on multiple chords at multiple places, playing different genres, taking your skill levels to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.
That's perfection done in the right way, which is directionally, you're now adding value to your learning. And I think that's the whole reality over here now.
It's so practice makes perfect, but you got to practice the right things. That's the balance. And when you practice the right things, you need to figure out what are those things that deliver the highest utility.
If practicing on the same chord delivers very low utility, then don't practice on the same chord. But practicing on multiple chords deliver the highest utility, move and shift to that. Because utility is the definition of what is it that you're trying to achieve. If your goal is to be ready to do a piano performance at my kids elementary school for Parents Day in three weeks, then that is a different objective. And then you work backwards from that as to what is doable in that timeline. That's how I would answer that question, sir. So look, I know one thing. I actually had the privilege of listening to the world's number one badminton player. He actually came to one of my company functions and he said something that blew me apart. He said to me, I can predict who's going to Be the best. They're not the perfectionist. The top players. They're the ones that practice the most with perfection. He didn't use the word perfection, though. He said consistency. These are people that will keep whacking that badminton shuttle. You know, the. The shuttle that you have on a coin.
Again, I missed it. No problem. He keeps banging it until he gets two in a row. Then he smiles. But then he goes back to banging it again and again and again.
And he says, that is so. He says consistency measured against did I hit the coin, yes or no? And did I hit it two times in a row? Then he knows that's perfection. Perfection is not hitting the coin six times in a row. Perfection, then is also celebrating that I just hit it twice in a row. Smile.
Breathe. Let's start again. And keep going, keep going, keep going. That is what make creates legends, the ability to keep practicing, whether it's the sun or shine at the end of the day. Look, we're sounding like bros right now, right? Two bros talking about sports. Right? You know, you're just thumping. The reality is that sports psychology and sports actually teach us a lot. I have the highest respect for the military, and I had to head the catch.
I have never served in the military, and I don't recall anyone in my family ever having studied in the military. Now, I cannot speak from a place, but I can tell you one thing. Discipline breeds structure.
Structure will eat strategy and culture for breakfast.
Sorry to Mr. Philip Kotler, who told the world that, you know, culture will eat strategy for breakfast. He's right. But I'm telling you right now was there's discipline and structure is going to. You can have the right culture, but if the culture is one which is not focused on the right discipline or the right structure to achieve success, you're not going to work. It's like being in a factory. I don't know if you remember this I Love Lucy episode where she's manufacturing chocolates. At some point, she loses control, and then she starts stuffing the chocolates down her blouse.
That was a revelation for me. What that taught me was something very simple. Guys, look at the structure she has. She's got the right mindset, she has the right attitude, she has the right culture. But guess what's happening right now? The system. She doesn't understand how the system works. It's failing her. The system needs to elevate you.
And without a system, you cannot elevate it. So I'm asking people, just please stop. Focus on the things that matter. And this is One of those conversations which is very difficult. People focus so much on culture, culture, culture, organizational culture, culture, culture. You can have an entrepreneurial culture, but if Your structure requires 20 days and 50 copies of a document to be filled out with a rubber stamp and then approved by 17 people, then that structure will eat your culture for breakfast. There'll be no entrepreneurship. You can kiss your backside. You'll never get it. So you need that balance. And I always say lead with structure. The rest will follow.
Perfect. Apologies. I digress again.
[00:37:02] Speaker B: You're good. So coming up, we're going to close with this. What it truly means to become battle ready in life and leadership. We'll be right back with Mr. Dubai Foreign.
Welcome back to Battle Ready. Don't miss a moment of this show or any Now Media TV favorite download Now Media TV app on Roku or iOS for 247 bilingual programming. If you prefer podcast, listen anytime on www.nowmed for business to culture from and beyond Now Media TV is always within reach now. Welcome back. For our final segment, we're stepping into the heart of today's conversation. What it truly means to be battle ready. This isn't about aggression. It's about mindset, strength and preparation for whatever, whatever life brings. Now, many people feel unprepared for challenges. They wait for crisis before building resilience instead of training their mindset daily. Dr. Buccha, what does battle ready mean to you in the world of leadership and growth?
[00:38:07] Speaker A: You know, this is really interesting, Battle ready. When I listen to words like that, I actually get nervous. Is the person who's using this ex military, is he aggressive? Is he assertive? Why are we using this word battle ready? And I think it's more about mindset. It's actually by simply stating, and I like the word battle. For me, battle means that this is actually a war.
You're going to go through it step by step. Battle ready means that we're going to pick small things, we're going to attack big, small things.
And I'm saying this intentionally, Ricky, and I'm not reading your mind or trying to understand why you named your show Battle Ready. Right. I'm giving you my perspective on it. For me, battle ready simply means that you recognize that one building a career or working through life is not just a battle. It's not just a war. It's a series of battles that ultimately culminate in some achievement, right? Some purpose. And for me, when you talk about leadership and growth, being battle ready means that you have trained your mind for those moments that will Challenge your resilience and clarity and you've gathered the right arsenal of tools to help you along the way. If that means that it's a little pickaxe in your hand or it's a little, I don't know, a two by two, two by four used to hit people. Yeah, fine. Battle ready. You are going to work on your discipline so that you overcome any last minute panic, as I call it. That's being battle ready. Being battle ready means that plans will not go the way they should, right? You are standing at the, what they call it, highest ground, right? And you think that you can see where the enemy is coming from and the enemy suddenly flies in and drops rocks on your head from over above. What happens at that point? Battle ready means being able to see contingencies, being able to understand the lay of the land and seeing where things could change and what would you do when those things change. So this is such a complex, such a powerful word that you're using here, Battle ready, right? Because at the end of the day, and you may lose that battle, Ricky, please understand. You haven't lost the war, my friend. You come back for another day. And I think that's how I read Battle ready when I saw it. And that's one of the reasons why I wanted to be on this show because I really felt there's a tremendous way to explain to your listeners that battle ready may sound like a war may sounds like we take no prisoners, right? But that's not what we're actually saying here. What we're actually saying is being the best that you can be, using the resources at your disposal and thinking with intentionality as to what you're going to do when you go out there. That's being battle ready. That's doing true justice to the way that you want to serve the world in the work that you do.
[00:40:28] Speaker B: You know, I totally agree with that. I think one of the things, you know, the Marine Corps, one of our sister militaries, they say, semper fidelis. Always faithful. My joke is, you know, the army, we're semper Gumby, always flexible. You know, you got to be flexible. Like you said, you're prepared for one thing and then they come throw rocks at. Now you got to re. Re regroup, right?
[00:40:46] Speaker A: And here's the fun part. When you say that we need to be flexible. If a common man says flexible, that to me, tells me that he's saying something, that we can bend the rules, we can break the rules. That's not what you're Saying, though, what you're saying is that within the boundary of integrity and within this discipline that we are with, we are flexible. Meaning that we are willing to let go of our own thought process, accept other people, accept better ideas. And I think that's the nuance in the point that you're making there, Ricky. That's the only thing I would call out. Flexibility doesn't mean that you are backing down from your principles. It means you are going to look at them from a different. Maybe we look at it from an empathetic lens. Maybe someone is asking for you to show more compassion in a different way. You do it by being flexible. Right. But you're still within the rules.
[00:41:33] Speaker B: No, that's. That's true. And that's just like somebody says, you know, does the military retreat? And I had a guy tell me this old Vietnam guy says, well, we don't have a retreat. We just attack in a different direction.
[00:41:45] Speaker A: No, no comment on that, boss. Absolutely. And, and. And there's. I'll tell you a whole lot different story about this Indian movie where the, The. The. The lead cop stands and he looks at his. The gang behind him. They're about to go into and raid a place and he says, okay, everyone.
Everyone who's with me, take a step forward.
Everyone takes a step back. He hears the sound of boots moving. He turns around and they all standing there. He says, that's the spirit. Let's go. It took the audience a minute to understand what the heck just happened there. What happened there was that they all retreated, but unfortunately he heard the sound of boots moving. When he turned back, they were all still symmetrically lined up. So he assumed that they all moved forward. So therefore he was like, yes, let's go. And then you have him charging into the building, and they're all like, oh, God. And then they all run in, and by the way, they do have a successful raid and everything is okay. But that moment was so funny.
So when you hear retreat, people actually think of retreat as defeat. No, retreat is not defeat. Retreat sometimes means going back, nursing your ego to come back stronger. And it's very powerful.
[00:42:47] Speaker B: So what behaviors or attitudes separate those who rise from those who give up?
[00:42:52] Speaker A: Oh, it's like a child, you know, when pressure gets created, the child doesn't understand the pressure, but they still remain curious about the world. They keep still asking questions. Yeah, Dad, I get it. But.
Okay, I get that, dad, but. And I think what happens with people is that when they are coming under pressure, their behaviors and attitudes change. Right. When the Going gets tough. The tough get going or the tough remain consistent. That doesn't happen because you're now running around like a headless chicken. Because that's what we intend to do. We either look for other people for guidance, we start doubting ourselves. So how do you figure that out? So one of the things I've noticed with the clients that I coach is that they still remain curious. They're under pressure.
Other people are falling into assumptions or fear. They don't. They hold back. And if they feel that they are bordering line making assumptions or making or fear is taking over, they do things differently. They start asking them some very simple questions. What am I fearing? Why am I fearing it? Is any data that you saw to fear? Deepak, this assumption you're making, is it an assumption made to go to safety or is an assumption to take some risk? How are you making it? And to me, that curiosity is very important.
Of the things that behavior that I see that when people take disciplined action instead of waiting for the perfect timing. Do you know the biggest surprise for me is watching mediocre people make more money than smart people? Because those mediocre people are not spending time thinking about how can I make my offer better? How can I build the perfect house? How can I build the perfect pitch to sell the best house? They actually focus on just doing something and doing it so fast and so quick. Actions. And again, actions will always take over very fast and very quick. So take discipline action rather than waiting for the perfect timing and conditions. That's one thing I've noticed successful people do a lot. Take responsibility for whatever happens. There's no such thing as blaming your excuses. You don't point the finger at someone else or you don't, you know, blame another administration. You're the man the buck stops with. You live up to it.
[00:44:45] Speaker B: No, I agree with that. I think a lot of people spend so much time preparing to prepare and they're. They're doing no. No actions. So there's. They're spending so much time to have the perfect plan in place.
[00:44:58] Speaker A: Ricky, there's a T shirt slogan that I'll give you would change my life. And this came from. I think it was Orit Kadish. She is Israeli. She is the head of. I think at that time she used to be head of BCG or Bain. I apologize to her in advance. She said something that actually changed my life. She Simply said, be 100% committed, even if you're 70% ready.
She says the problem is that the effort you're going to put to get this 30% level of readiness is the law of diminishing returns. Once you have 70% information and 70% of the logic in place, go ahead 100% commitment and start executing. Because you will realize that while you wait for the remaining 30% to catch up, it delivers so little value that you might as well have started at 70%.
And that was so powerful because what that told me was that stop being perfect. You've got enough information to tell you that there's something smelly with this story, right? You don't need to wait for more information to make the determination. You've got a good instinct. Trust the instinct. Now start asking questions to actually confirm whether what you're smelling is bad or smelling is good. And I, so I took that to.
[00:46:03] Speaker B: Real heart, totally agree with that.
Everybody waits to get to that 100%. Just shoot, move, communicate, adjust, adjust, adjust, adjust.
[00:46:13] Speaker A: Just don't shoot and then aim. Just don't shoot and then aim. Right?
And that's where people get it wrong. We're not asking for comical results, right? We're still asking you to aim. But what we're saying is that you aim. You got the crosshairs now you can sit there, regulate your breathing, but at some point you got to take that shot because that person is going to move out of the shot. Then what's going to happen? So everything is time bound, right? Your readiness of perfection doesn't mean that the other person is static. And I don't know how to explain this to you, but this is the reality. People that focus on perfectionism actually forget that what they're trying to do is part of a bigger ecosystem. Just because you perfect that one, you've actually now delayed things, they may jeopardize the overall achievement. So you need to understand your perfectionism or need for perfectionism in the context of the larger picture. And that's where most people fail, my friend. That's where I totally agree with Dan.
[00:47:01] Speaker B: So, Dr. Butra, it's been incredible and valuable. How can people follow your, your work, learn about you and, and just get a hold of you?
[00:47:09] Speaker A: Absolutely. Like I mentioned before, LinkedIn. Follow me on LinkedIn subscribe to LinkedIn I have two newsletters on LinkedIn. One newsletter is absolutely for sales. Uncharted is what I call it, Ricky. It's for salespeople. The other one is more for generic career guidance and leadership. It's designed for people between 21 to 30. Though I must be honest with you, most of my subscribers are above 40 and love it. Anyway, because sometimes you do want to read that Tintin comic or that fairy tale at age 40 to remind you what is it that you're potentially missing. And curiosity, that of a child, can sometimes give you a perspective which is so powerful, so unique, that it can actually change not just your life, but change the way you interact with others. That's the message I would share with you and close off on Ricky at this point.
[00:47:52] Speaker B: Perfect. So thank you, Dr. Buto, for sharing such powerful, actionable insight. Today we learn how to communicate with confidence, handle rejection and strength, release perfectionism, and embrace a mindset that prepares us for whatever lies ahead. Remember, being Battle Ready isn't about fighting harder. It's about thinking clearer, growing stronger, and leading with purpose. Look forward to seeing you again on Battle Ready. Have a great day.
